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Is this Pujol?   You are logged in as Guest
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NormanKliman

Posts: 1143
Joined: Sep. 1 2007
 

Is this Pujol? 
Hi everyone,

I'd be grateful if someone can tell me if this is a composition of Emilio Pujol:0

http://www.ctv.es/USERS/norman/ejercicioanonimo.htm

This is one of the things that my first teacher showed me in Madrid about 20 years ago. He said it was called "Ejercicio anónimo" (Anonymous Exercise). Since then, I've asked several classical guitarists about it, but nobody was able to shed any light on the subject.

A couple of years ago, I heard Luis Pastor play this thing in Madrid almost exactly as my teacher had shown it to me. I asked him about it and he said that it was written by Pujol. I assumed that he meant Emilio Pujol and I checked every piece by this composer in the Biblioteca Nacional in Madrid. I only found a couple of things that are somewhat similar, but they're too different to be the same thing.

What intrigues me about this little exercise is that it seems to have formed a part of the repertoire of guitarists in Madrid a few decades ago.

Thanks in advance for any information!
Norman

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 18 2007 15:19:41
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14819
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to NormanKliman) 
Sorry not sure. If no one discovers, I will check out my Dad's stuff when I make it to my moms next week. He had lots of Pujol music.

is this YOUR site norman?
http://www.ctv.es/USERS/norman/

If so, very very nice. I especially like the evolution of a falseta and the old siguiriyas stuff.

Ricardo
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 18 2007 15:40:47
 
NormanKliman

Posts: 1143
Joined: Sep. 1 2007
 

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to Ricardo) 
Hi Ricardo,

Thanks for the quick response! That's my page; glad to hear you like it. It's long overdue for some new material! I've got a few more things up my sleeve, but this exercise is something I've been wanting to add for years now. Before I do that, though, I'd like to have a peek at the original version, assuming that there is one. The end of the transcription is my own arrangement, so I'd like to see how this appears in the alleged composition of Pujol.

I forgot to mention that my teacher learned this piece from his teacher. That's what makes me think that this must have been a part of the repertoire of Madrid guitarists. For that reason, I expect that someone will quickly recognize it.

You guys have a very nice thing going here with this forum! Plenty of knowledge amid a nice friendly atmosphere.

Thanks again,
Norman

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 18 2007 16:02:13
 
duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to NormanKliman) 
Norman, your site was among the first places i could find some info and material when i first started to play flamenco.

thank you

Henrik

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 18 2007 16:09:46
 
NormanKliman

Posts: 1143
Joined: Sep. 1 2007
 

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to duende) 
Well thank you, Henrik, for contributing to flamenco guitar!!! I had a listen to the alegrías on your webpage and enjoyed it very much. Solid compás and execution!

Best wishes,
Norman

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 18 2007 16:31:50
 
guitarbuddha

 

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007
 

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to NormanKliman) 
Hi Norman, the style looks a little early for Pujol ( he was a romantic composer,and a follower of Tarrega ) more like Carruli or Molina. But maybe he did this piece in that style as part of his method ( he wrote a method based on the principles of Tarrega since Tarrega was too busy ) you might find this excercise there. Sorry I cant be of more help as I never studied Pujol's method. His most famous surviving pieces are his arrangements of Catalan folk songs, one of which can be found at the back of Fred Noads Solo Guitar (first volume) which you might have lying around.

The style looks very like Fernando Carrulli ( somehow it doesnt ring true as Fernando Sor ) but I doubt that he would have used an a minor sixth so prominantly. So ... if it is Pujol it is probably a Pastiche hidden away somewhere in his method. Who knows maybe there was a crossover teacher in Madrid taking flamenco pupils through Pujol. Oddly enough it looks a little some of the pieces from the Sagrereras method ( the old Spanish TV show 'Flamenco' used to start with a flameco version ripping through and murdering Sagrereras' most famous concert encore piece 'El Colibri' so there is definately a history of some players studying classical pieces). Barrios also wrote some studies in e minor with similar texture to this but I have never seen this one and I have never seen a piece of his where he restricted himself to open positions.

Best of luck.

D.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 18 2007 17:12:46
 
NormanKliman

Posts: 1143
Joined: Sep. 1 2007
 

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to NormanKliman) 
Hi everyone,

Thanks for all the help! Someone on another board has identified it as "Preludio," the third of seven pieces of "Colección de siete piezas miniatura" by José María Navarro Porcel. It was copyrighted in 1941, so I don't know if I'll be able to add it to my website.

Thanks again to all for your interest.

Best wishes,
Norman

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 19 2007 7:02:06
 
guitarbuddha

 

Posts: 2970
Joined: Jan. 4 2007
 

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to NormanKliman) 
Copyright might be for the arranger or publisher Norman, your computer edition might be fine.
PS... Sorry for all the red herrings.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 19 2007 13:04:52
 
NormanKliman

Posts: 1143
Joined: Sep. 1 2007
 

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to guitarbuddha) 
Hi David,

Red herrings? I'd say that was some valuable information. Maybe not as applies to the identification of this piece of music, but your insight on this kind of music is much appreciated. I copied and pasted the information into a document that I've saved on my hard drive, so thanks again!!!

Best wishes,
Norman

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 19 2007 14:30:16
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14819
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to NormanKliman) 
Under fair use clause, you are allowed to use an excerpt from it for educational purposes. Otherwise why not get a liscense and pay a few cents for it??? You can probably download an agreement from library of congress, then email the publisher, have them fax it signed, and then send them a check. Easy.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 19 2007 14:32:25
 
NormanKliman

Posts: 1143
Joined: Sep. 1 2007
 

RE: Is this Pujol? (in reply to Ricardo) 
Hi Ricardo,

Hey, that's a good idea! I've never bothered looking into the terms of licensing. I've come across a few things that were copyright protected but I was granted permission by the authors. The Libarary of Congress, eh? I'll have to look into that.

In any case, my interest in adding this music to the website has more to do with nostalgia than anything else. Nostalgia and improving the section on exercises. I still play my version of this piece to warm up on occasion, but I suppose something similar could be put together that would make for an even better workout.

When I'm getting back into playing after a week or so away from the guitar, I like (?) going over alegrías in E without a capo. Beats the hell out of my hands right quick!!!

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 19 2007 18:51:51
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