Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.
This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.
We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.
|
|
|
the ultimate Conde!
|
You are logged in as Guest
|
|
Users viewing this topic: none
|
|
Login  | |
|
   
Ricardo
Posts: 14799
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
|
 RE: the ultimate Conde! (in reply to turnermoran)
|
|
|
About the guitar, Al had his orginal sobrinos altered by CHris carrington, the luthier that also played with him in world sinfonia. I guess conde copied the idea and now its an endorsement deal.
About Al...to give him credit it was always HIS idea to do the guitar duo thing. Lets be honest, Entre dos Aguas made Paco famous in europe but mediterranean sundance made paco WORLD famous as Al DI was playing ARENAS not small concert halls at that time. THe Trio idea was J. Mclaughlin's idea after hearing that duet anyway. Original was to be Paco John and John williams or some other classical player...3 different styles...but it would be impossible unless all 3 could adapt to chart reading and improvisation. So they end up with super guitar trio with Larry and then John switch to nylon to make up for the missing sound of a "classical nylon" guitar. So steel, nylon, and flamenco. Al only wanted duets with Paco and still tried and failed recording of fantasia suite. Passion grace and fire got recorded finally. But meanwhile larry got ill (wasted?? LOL) and so Al wanted paco and paco said hey I am going with JOhn come with me.
So the famous trio ended up on AL's label, and it would never had been so huge had not THOSE 3 got together. So now the negative stuff. Al was the younger guy and had the ego to deal with that the more seasoned guys didn't have as much (my opinion). When they arrived to record second album...Paco apparantly was not so happy about med sun not getting Paco royalty credit. Especially after success. So Al like whatever...so wrote Paco a check (yeah it's really Paco's tune anyway except the intro 20 sec...it's entre dos aguas mixed with rio ancho)...so like "happy now???" then paco said in front of him "John I ll play on any of your record free anytime" and so begun the rift.
Mclaughin reunited the trio for one tune on "the promise" and then everybody around them had idea of trio reunion. They recorded...and anybody that is into these guys can tell that Al did a lot of work on it vs the other two...interms of it being a new music project. Even al has a solo piece that the other two had no time to learn. Anyway they hit the road. Al has tinnitus (ringing in the ears) and has constant tuning problems. Paco got impatient and told Al not so nicely to fix the darn tuning. Al exploded about past on him and finally Paco punched his face. Al went to the hospital. I heard about this even from 3 or 4 indepentant sources and years ago it was semi confirmed by Al's behavior on his own forum. lawyers got involved and the tour continued peacefully but not friendly. Mclaughlin was asked and said "the only egoless persons are saints, and you don't find saints playing guitar"....so they all admit fault but moved passed it.
Now after all that drama....Mclaughlin box comes out, 17 CDs or somehting. He wants to use montreux trio show but AL says NO WAY. In fact in his own words I read on his forum he said "that's not the john mclaughlin trio...offer it for release separate from the box or you can't use it"...also bad mouthed Mclaughlin's manager. Also to mess with those guys he offered his own vault copy of vid footage of FNISF...(which I went out of my way to get at his show...it was crap bootleg, then he took it all back on his forum and said someone ELSE was peddling bootlegs at his show!!!!! LOL) IN a mclaughlin interview he frankly states, there will NOT ever be a trio union in the future. Instead you have the Paco John duo concert which is great anyway. Paco and john continue to play. That concert in 2010 where AL was in Germany...well it's just one song but a surprise. Obvious paco didn't move past it...but hey it's still cool they could at least get on stage and do that.
_____________________________
CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
|
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 14 2012 3:21:43
 |
|
Ricardo
Posts: 14799
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
|
|
RE: the ultimate Conde! (in reply to Ruphus)
|
|
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Ruphus
Hey Ricardo,
As much as you might musically theorize into it:
It will change little to nothing on the fact that the three were all too obviously taken away by public´s appreciation of the day, missing out on meeeting beforehand for an appropriate period of time ( like a couple of weeks at least ) to first of all generate something together.
They clearly overestimated the possibility of spontaneously producing / improvising a gig that would yield something:
# new / enriching foregone output / worth the event
# spoon out from the teaming up
At best compose some new pieces together, just like your common band will.
Instead their coming together brought nothing other to the table than exactly the "fast scale and competition of sorts" that were flattering none of them. ( Not even McL.´s, whose fumbled venyls after a couple of eager turntable sessions never did anything other than gathering dust in my shelve anyway.)
I always admire your musical competence, but am confident enough of my musical perception to tell apart a patent dud from musical creation.
If your analysing or playing after has been giving satisfaction in a way, that be just the more outlandish to me ( why on earth playing after athletic pedaling, when you can have the original pieces harmonically round / in compository complementing order and undisturbed?). Musically that SNISF thingy remains a very obvious understatement for who knows the based-on discography; a missed opportunity and performance broke.
Be honest: Can it be that you didn´t widely know the artists´ repertoire at the point in time when you took the hazzles to play after SNISF?
The three should have prepared before the gigs as due, and could had easily turned out something pulling.
Could have been even McLaughling to contribute something spicy.
Ruphus
Again, you are entitled to your generaliztions. We could get into specifics if you truely cared...but since you don't, you win. It sucked for you, you gain nothing from such a fusion, my admitance that there is depth and inspiration there is "outlandish". Ok great, your loss. Now moving on with actual playing music.
http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=46084&appid=&p=&mpage=1&key=&tmode=&smode=&s=#46084
_____________________________
CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
|
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 14 2012 15:36:19
|
|
Mark2
Posts: 1871
Joined: Jul. 12 2004
From: San Francisco
|
|
RE: the ultimate Conde! (in reply to turnermoran)
|
|
|
I like some of Al's work, especially with Return to Forever, and some stuff off his own records. Also I'm a fan of JM, from his electric group to his Indian influenced stuff to his brilliant solo acoustic record, My Goals Beyond. I like some of Larry's stuff too, but when listening to the trio, it"s clear that Paco is so much better.
Paco, who apparantly had little experience in improvising solos, time and time again, just blows the other guys out with phrasing, note selection, commitment, and flat out excitement. You can hear the audience clearly react more to Paco's solos in many of the live vids.
I think the sound of picado is more exciting than pick playing, but it's more than that. Paco is simply a way better guitarist than all of his fellow trio guitarists. And given the company, and the fact that he's operating outside his core style, that's pretty impressive.
|
|
|
|
REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 15 2012 15:12:36
|
|
 New Messages |
 No New Messages |
 Hot Topic w/ New Messages |
 Hot Topic w/o New Messages |
 Locked w/ New Messages |
 Locked w/o New Messages |
|
Post New Thread
Reply to Message
Post New Poll
Submit Vote
Delete My Own Post
Delete My Own Thread
Rate Posts
|
|
|
Forum Software powered by ASP Playground Advanced Edition 2.0.5
Copyright © 2000 - 2003 ASPPlayground.NET |
9.472656E-02 secs.
|
Printable Version
